My first post and introductory statement
Dear reader,
I am a lifetime introvert and misfit who saw that there were appallingly few resources on the internet that addressed the most basic issues and questions of the Subtle experience.
There are plenty of sites about introverts, but most are written from the viewpoint of an outsider looking in. There were no answers, only unhelpful platitudes and a fundamental lack of understanding.
I decided to set out to write from the perspective of an introverted outcast with emphasis on usually hidden perceptions and opinions. Why hidden? Because revealing such feelings to mainstream persons is both counterproductive and dangerous. It occurred to me that the web was the safest method to make these issues public.
My objectives in doing so:
-To show isolated introverts that they are not alone.
-To persuade introverts that they should not change, that they should take pride in what they are and develop their true nature to its fullest, even if doing so means complete departure conventional society.
-Extroverts are constantly confused by our thought patterns and motives. Here they are, laid out for the public eye…
-To examine the possibility of a union of introverted persons so we can have an organization in which we are accepted and understood.
I have my posts grouped into rough categories now that I have accumulated a good many.
My content is not time sensitive as is often the case. Posts written in the beginning days of this blog are as relevant to my purpose as the latest post.
As for my background:
I am, Gluon, a Ferengi merchant regrettably shipwrecked on a world full of tiny eared people who have never even heard of the Rules of Acquisition.
My central website can be found at
I can be contacted at
zygmunt@gluontheferengi.com
You write well. However, Ferengi is not the sort of credential I was looking for. As an extremely isolated introvert myself, I’m wondering if you have any educational or professional credentials in psychology, or do you speak only from personal experience?
Sorry to say, I am no professor of psychology. I speak mostly from personal experience and from personal reading.
If I had great credentials, I imagine I would be publishing in academic journals using high language that no layman could understand. I might have great knowledge, but without you spending huge amounts of time and money on psychology classes, it wouldn’t make any sense to you. You would be entirely reliant on middlemen who have their own agendas to have any access to my well-qualified research.
Furthermore, my research would not be infallible. I would only have funding to research the things people who have money want me to research. The people with money and power will also affect how prominently my work gets published or if it gets published.
I write purely as an amateur. I do so because I think much of the time, the professionals are highly overrated. Not for lack of knowledge, but because they are extreme specialists who tend to be closed off from other relevant sources of insight, who are restricted in their scope by the economic demands of their profession.
I too look to highly qualified academics as a useful source of information, but I see their limits. Should credentials be seen as the end all be all or simply as tickets that we punch along a career path?
If ‘Ferengi’ is not good enough of credentials, focus on academic journals instead of blogs.
I meant no offense; I was just curious about a contemplative Ferengi who writes well.
No offense taken then. Though, I must admit ‘contemplative Ferengi’ sounds like something of an oxymoron.
I originally made myself a Ferengi to complete a pun. My first blog was named ‘WordPressed Latinum’ after the DS9 currency. I named myself Gluon because of the obnoxious Ferengi merchant, Quark, in DS9. His nephew, Nog calls him ‘Uncle Quark.’
I’m not a Ferengi. I’m an introvert too, and I share your reluctance to take part in Facebook as it brings up the soame sort of social awkwardness that one-on-one interaction induces. Even posting a comment to a bog – even one such as this – causes me palpitations
But I’m here, and I’m lurking.
Fine, lurk to your heart’s content. I rarely commented on blogs before I actually started one. I fully understand that an introverted audience isn’t usually going to openly communicate. What matters is if someone has read something and gotten something out of it. I love to get feedback, but that’s not my first concern.
I also understand your reluctance to thrust yourself into the public domain. To do so means exposure and vulnerability.
I really enjoy your site and think you would appreciate the book, Party of One, by Anneli Rufus. It’s kind of a history and celebration of the introvert and “loner” in western society. Also, there is MTV’s Daria series, which is great for unwinding after working with extraverts all day. There are many parallels with the work world despite the pre-facebook and cell phone, high school setting.
I agree the book, Party of One, is an excellent read.
I’m not sure what to say (or write) as i’ve never been one much for commenting; but i’ve never come upon a blog (and a well written blog at that) that caters to the introverted in such a firsthand, knowledgeable way and i had to stop my incessant lurking and finally post some sort of comment.
I am quite young (about to begin my freashman year of colledge), and have always been called shy (even painfully shy). Although i have never used the lable of “introvert” (as i can be rather assertive when the occasion calls for it), I have been accused of being constantly “stuck in a book” or in desperate need to “get out of my head and live life”.
I wanted to thank you for taking the initiative to write this blog, especially the entries ” Why Are Such A High Proportion of Gifted People Introverted?” and “Introvert vs. Extrovert: Mental Health”. I’ve always done very well in school and have been labled gifted by more than a few teachers and standardized tests. i have also wondered just how crazy, weird, or mentally unstable i am because i hate large crowds, high school parties and meeting new people. enough people, friends, and acquaintances have asked such questions as “who (or what kind of person) doesn’t want to go to a party? ” for me to question my own mental health.
i am in inexplicably glad to have come across your blog which to me is a breath of fresh sanity.
Hello,
Like Christina, I am also a young introvert (sophomore). I discovered the concept of introvertism only last year after taking a Psych 101 course. Previously, I used to think that I was just socially inept and this belief has caused a great many problems.
Growing up I never took school seriously. Even though I was by most labeled as “smart”, I would typically just barely pass my classes, rarely if ever doing homework. I had no real friends and would hate going to school (I took 30+ “sick days” per year).
I skipped my entire freshman year of highschool by lying to my parents. Each morning I would leave the house pretending that I was off to school, only to come back when my parents left for work, and then proceed to sit on the computer all day. This charade eventually ended when I dropped out of high school and worked a series of manual labor jobs.
Employed in a restaurant, I was literally forced to develop my social skills. It was not too long before I became rather proficient in faking the extrovert traits necessary for survival.
I received my GED and enrolled in community college. Also, found a job in an office setting that most would consider lucrative. Yet, I am still a virgin with no friends. Not that I am too bothered by this as I know that eventually I will find people that I can form a real connection with.
So far the couple of posts on this website have been very intriguing and I look forward to more.
Sometimes I wonder what life would’ve been like if I hadn’t just followed what my society wanted me to do for most of my youth.
I often feel as though my life began at age 18 after a 12 year sentence to schooling. In retrospect, I really only learned a very tiny amount of the curriculum in any useful, lasting form and I was taking it seriously. Because I was taking things seriously, I was fairly good at producing results at school. This often meant learning material on a superficial level long enough to regurgitate it for a test.
Most of the information given to us was transient and completely out of context. The stuff we had to learn one week in order to keep grades up would disappear the next, never to be heard of again.
It was like a story with lots of plot elements that the writer never bothers to tie together.
I left high school after years of being told grades were actually important only to find that no one on earth cares besides college admissions offices. All those years of work only ever really make a difference once in one’s life.
It was one of the first big lessons I had. Now after many more of these debunkings it seems everything the mass society has ever told me has been a lie.
Well I understand why the importance of grades is drilled into our heads, as typically a student with an A is learning far more from the class than someone with an F. They are the ones participating, doing the homework, and studying the material for the tests.
In stark contrast to high school and below, my college GPA is 3.7+. One reason for this is that I found that the more I got involved with the classwork, the less bored I felt in class. If I just focus on being on being an excellent student, there is far less chance for any negative thoughts to arise. Also, as I have finally begun to study subjects I actually care about, Philosophy/ Psychology/ Socialogy, I find that it takes very little effort on my part to get those A’s.
A student getting As is going to learn more than a student that doesn’t care. This doesn’t mean that the system is effective, however.
Effectiveness should be measured against how much those who are willing to participate actually learn.
Actually, maybe there’s something wrong or irrelevant about the system if a significant number of people can’t even be bothered to participate.
I would warn against majoring in soft sciences unless you’re planning to go into academia or law school. For most people, trying to go into academia isn’t a great idea.
Liberal arts are going to have far more people looking for tenure than there are available positions.
I too am fascinated by the subjects you listed, but college has to be able to justify its exorbitant cost.
A lot of people talk about the ineffectiveness of our school systems. As far back as Plato you can see arguments against standard education. However, I have not heard any viable solutions being presented. How else can one entice students to participate if there is no motivation from grades?
I know that for us introverts it is rare that we would raise our hands during class and that unjustly lowers our grades. I like the approach my Philosophy professor takes to this issue: He doesn’t expect people to constantly speak out; in fact he devoted a section in the syllabus to alternative ways of participation. After every class I email him my thoughts on the matter and he would occasionally respond with lengthy replies of encouragement. All professors should recognize that there are introverts in class that would love to participate, however, it simply is not always possible to voice out our thoughts in the brief moments given in class.
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Yes, I’m aware of the lack of job opportunities for soft sciences. However, for a lot of jobs it does not matter what your major actually is, all they care about is that you have a degree. If I have to devote years of classes to something, I would prefer to study something interesting.
If students need a form of coercion and competition to be made to study, then surely the entire system has already failed.
A school that fails to arouse some sort of desire for knowledge turns out students that will soon forget everything they were forced to read in school and never pick up another book in their lives.
Through most of human history there’s been no standard education available to a significant percentage of the population. There’s clearly lots of other viable solutions.
Since we’ve mentioned philosophy: Why must everyone be forced into school with taxpayer money? Lots of these students who are a burden on every wage earner don’t even want to be there.
Do schools of the industrialized era really change the typical pattern? A minority of human beings actually end up educated, just as it’s ever been.
It may be one of those hard politically incorrect facts: perhaps most people will never want or need education beyond basic literacy and arithmetic. Perhaps naturally curious people have managed to access knowledge no matter when or where. Perhaps for someone who isn’t particularly driven by curiosity and is never going to have a need anyway, years of teaching is a waste.
Why not bring back child labor and allow suitably educated young people to go to work as soon as possible if they don’t want to learn? Also, let them come back to school if work gives them a new perspective on schooling.
My point here is that there’s nothing necessarily sacrosanct about our present way of doing things. There’s an infinity of possibilities and solutions available if one can think beyond established assumptions.
So your idea is to basically make schooling past the 5th grade completely optional? How many parents would allow their children to drop out in 6th grade because their kids don’t have a “desire for knowledge?” Oh little Johnny doesn’t like algebra, so we took him out and put him to work collecting garbage.
Clearly such a proposition seems absurd to you. However, why is telling little Johnny: “You’re spending your entire youth going to a school you don’t want to be in.” any better than collecting garbage.
If collecting garbage is so horrible, maybe little Johnny will decide he’d rather be in school. Maybe Johnny will learn better if he attends school sporadically rather than being forced to go all the time.
Old fashioned school houses often had kids of all different ages at different levels of learning. Yet with some individual attention, this simple system seems to have done its job.
Lots of the kids would have been farmers’ children who were too busy to attend school regularly. It seems they managed to make fairly effective use of the time they had.
Since when is it holy writ that schooling must be a child’s full time occupation?
I realize child labor is banned because it comes with plenty of problems. My main point is that if some basic assumptions are questioned or put into perspective, solutions we’d never ordinarily consider become worth thinking about. What is so great about the way we do things now? Right now, disruptive students are stuck in classrooms for years. Not only do they not learn anything, they prevent those who want to learn from learning. As things stand, everyone loses yet we hold to our ways just because it’s what we’ve been told is good and its what we’re familiar with.
We could go into a considerable degree of nuance here. Let’s say we were to conclude 5th grade is too early but 12th grade is far too late. Maybe we simply make school optional at say 14 years of age. This doesn’t solve any underlying problems but maybe it makes things less bad than they are now.
I just came across your blog.I enjoy reading about introverts’ experiences since we are a minority. I’ve never known any introverts other than myself and comments about how I should be more outspoken and less shy lead me to analyse what is wrong with me since I was twelve.Comments about me by teachers were quiet and reserved and I should speak up more in class. My classmates created a hate blog about how I dont talk to anyone.
When I got distinction for a written essay, I was rediculed for being able to write better than I speak and one day, I was brought into the school’s office and advised by a teacher that I wouldn’t make it in the real world if I continue on like this. When I need to do presentations, I give them my best shot and though I’m not the best, I’m better than the noisy outspoken dude in my class who did not contribute anything to the group work and just used his mouth to talk. I guess its a clash of an extreme extrovert and an introvert.
I’m currently studying management and its a challenge in my school in which my lecturers are the ones who suggest the whole class to add one another for social networking. I don’t see the need but I thought I had to fit in. I could not believe I created a twitter and even added friends whom I didn’t know.I am back to my normal self though. We are tertiary students and though I am one or two years older than them, I can’t believe how desperate all of them want to be popular. An outspoken classmate posted a wall post which is full of criticism about a renowned pianist and there were 20 positive replies to that. It shocked me why they think so highly of themselves and the need to post 20 wall posts in a day in caps lock really irk me.
I was told to be more outspoken constantly and I tried so hard.I went to a party when I rather stay at home reading and I pretended to be someone I’m not in facebook. I took pictures of myself with crazy facial expressions so I looked “happier” other than my usually dull expression judged by others.
The school system clearly needs a structure that accomodates introverts especially those who enjoy learning. It’s not a fair game.In fact, I don’t think I learn much in school and my lecturers who emphasize on speaking up more in class. Ironically, the ones who speak up in my class were gossiping instead of contributing.
After my Gcse, a teacher who recognised my gift in humanities encouraged me to take A levels but my dad had no confidence of me passing and all through my life, he was always mocking at how I am afraid of talking to people and how nobody likes me and I will be a failure. I believed him and emtered a course I had no interest in and failed and I am still building up my confidence in my current course. The relationship between me and my classmates is a challenge, Introverts can do well in life, not just extroverts.
A great deal of confusion comes from the fact that introversion is very often correlated with shyness. As introverts we naturally have much less opportunity to socialize and thus our social skills as children lag far behind the extroverts. As a result of poor social skills we are ridiculed by our peers which destroys our self confidence and cause us to be frightened and anxious.
Shyness is thus very often a direct result of an introvert that is in a hostile extrovert setting. As we age, our social skills gradually catch up with extroverts and we recover our sense of self worth.
This blog started as an experiment to see if there were others out there dealing with similar problems. I reasoned that I could not possibly be unique, that like other sorts of people, I must be part of a larger pattern, albeit a much more dispersed one.
As a kid I spent a lot of time reading. Books seem to have had as great an impact as people in determining my speech patterns. It took me years to stop using the ‘wrong’ vocabulary in everyday speech. I only talk like that now if I’m around people I’m very close to or if I’ve had a few drinks.
That’s my old informal tongue. If I speak the informal tongue in the wrong place, people seem to conclude I’m a snob, an automaton, or both. Even so, I think some people catch on that I’m not quite relaxed in everyday situations. I frequently get asked what country I’m from or told I have a strange accent. I find the Common tongue to be minimal and bare as if scraped clean by sandpaper.
I always wondered what motivated people on facebook to portray themselves out partying and making faces. I often wonder if you could find the exact same sort of pictures on 98 profiles out of 100. Doing what everyone else is doing is surely not the best way to get attention.
I too am perplexed by the Loud need to harshly criticize one’s betters. Probably just trying to build themselves up by knocking down a bigger person who’s somewhere else and can’t possibly retaliate. So silly and petty.
I’m not sure the present system really can accommodate introverts. By its very nature, schools are a collective environment.
There was a 10% participation grade in a lot of my college courses. Maybe some Loud person thought of this provision as being ‘free points’ to help students pass. My experience in these courses was that one or two people who could talk the most while saying the least ended up dominating all discourse. I just wanted them to shut up. I was in that classroom so I could learn from the professor, not so I could listen to the lovely sound of my own voice. This attitude of mine lost me points every term while the most obnoxious people were rewarded.
Unfortunately, all those people’s doubts in you have a real possibility of self-fulfilling since they’ve been attacking your self confidence for years. Your struggle is going to be coping with all that negative reinforcement and not allowing all those dire predictions to come to pass.
Your critics see themselves as benefactors who are trying to help you out, even if a little tough love is necessary. They want to wake you up to their reality with hard facts and criticism. Often a shock is just what people need to be motivated to change themselves after all… In practice, they’ve just ended up punishing you for being you.
Now, many of the things they say have a point. Your critics know you have to be assertive and aggressive to survive in a mass society. When there’s millions of people who are just numbers, only the Loudest can manage to attract attention to their needs. In order to earn above subsistence and be able to afford children in an industrialized society you have to ‘know people’.
Your family pushed you into a field in which you did not fit. Every profession attracts a type of person just like a bar. With publicly visible workers like cops, one can readily perceive that they all seem to be a similar type in terms of both of physical appearance and personality.
I’ve come to think that community is the most critical decider when it comes to professional success.
Whatever, you do choose to do now in college, make sure it does lead to a profession. The humanities can shelter you for a little while, but the consequences of graduating with a degree that’s not in demand are grave.
Your critics are trying to save you from an uphill battle in this life.
However, they can’t ‘save you’ from being who you are.
You’re going to have to go uphill.
I think this uphill course develops Subtle people in a different way than most others. We can’t just take a path of least resistance as many others seem to. No such option exists! I’ve often wished I had a direction in which I could just let myself flow!
Technically, School is optional at age 16. with a guardian’s approval it’s legal to drop out as young as 14.
14 is also the legal at which one may obtain a GED. Although, age limits vary state by state.
sorry your point is moot.
It is moot?
I see it as a sort of confirmation that in my ignorance, I suggested exactly what someone else already thought of. It makes sense to give people who won’t learn and who are going to impede others from learning a way out.
For these regulations to make a difference, though, there need to be less restrictions of what minors can do. So long as children have nothing to do but sit at home,
school remains necessary as a public daycare.
It might be legally possible to drop out of school at a certain age, but this is a moot point until society permits the dropouts to actually do something other than school.
In most places age 14 is going to be a year or two before people can legally work.
Hopefully, this provision also serves as a way for the brightest students to test out of the whole system and move on quickly to the university level. A military style “one size fits all” attitude is one of the defining characteristics of modern schooling. I’m happy if there’s some ways to get around it.
I’m also aware no school is going to make it easy to ‘escape.’ Each student in the school is a source of cash. As such, schools will deliberately hide any programs they have for testing out and put up as many bureaucratic hurdles as possible.
So long as all the incentives point to keeping kids stuck in school for both parents and the schools themselves, I would suppose the impact of any new regulations is going to be minimal. But at least there is some choice somewhere.
Not to mention there is always the option of home schooling.
I think most of us can agree that certain skills such as basic math, science, etc. are vital in modern society. Simply taking out the introvert from school is not the ideal solution. The schooling systems need to recognize the need to cater to introverts. As it stands now, most teachers don’t even really know what introverts are, much less how to insure introverts are treated properly.
Count Basino,
What I’m getting at here:
Rather than finessing a system that is fundamentally set against introverts:
Imagine what other systems could exist.
Luther rather than Erasmus.
I am an introvert who home schools 5 children. I love learning along with them. B/c they are with me all day, it is challenging to find contemplative, introvert time. However, because I would not want to institutionalize them and rob them of the joy of learning, I keep them home. I realized by reading some of your posts that introverts do have an advantage for home schooling b/c the introvert teacher really does love to learn for learning’s sake and is not teaching for a paycheck. When I am done with my teaching for the day I can be found reading for fun in a quiet place-if one can be found. Many home schools use virtual school as an alternative for classes that the parents do not care to teach. This is ideal for introvert kids as well. My extrovert children are involved in weekly in-person classes, sports, church and play with the neighborhood kids. This meets their need for interaction(as if living in a home with 7 people weren’t enough!) I am a firm believer that each family has a right to choose how to educate their kids. There are many options and no one should feel sentenced to the “normal” public school system. If that is what fits you and your kids by all means choose it, but if not then explore all your options and choose what’s best for your kids.
Hi:
I rarely comment on blogs and forums, but i’d like to say, i’ve always thought of myself as being different than most people, i read much on introversion and extroversion, and i could say, most of the ideas which i spent much time pondering on is incredibly close to yours. I have also spent much effort trying to ‘fit in’ this society, pretend to be outgoing, with no success. But recently, i embraced the introversion side of me, your blog reconfirmed my own thoughts and ideas of where i belong in this world.
Much thanks.
I really appreciate your writings, i currently live in a city environment,naturally its densely populated and somewhat unbearable to me, i would like to escape to a small town less populated location(hopefully sustain myself with a small business).I’m curious, what are your thoughts on voluntary exile,and also if small towns are better environments for introverts who want to escape extrovert society.
also to add, not only “small towns”, less populated areas in general,
are they an ideal environment,whats your opinion, (i don’t mean to make the question loaded).
I think we introverts are kind of like cockroaches. So long as a few basic requirements are met we can live almost anywhere. I think it’s the extros who are going to be a bit more finicky.
I’ve lived happily in both the city and the country.
The country offers easy access to the outdoors with plentiful quiet spots. People are friendlier, more accepting, more trusting, more introverted. There’s not many options when it comes to obtaining resources. Have to order anything you can’t find at the nearest Wal-Mart over the internet.
The city on the other hand offers anonymity within the crowd. You can live with near certainty that no one will bother you without good reason. It offers access to lots of niche businesses and services to serve unorthodox needs. It’s also more possible to find niche groups of people.
The bottom line whether in Antarctica or New York City is to have a safe place or time(s) of day where no one will bother you. The one true requirement of life is a sanctuary.
I truly thought I was alone…it’s as if I were watching my own thoughts as I read each post…Thank you. that’s all I can say…THANK YOU…I feel renewed.
my god…who ARE you!
quote~”I think this uphill course develops Subtle people in a different way than most others. We can’t just take a path of least resistance as many others seem to. No such option exists! I’ve often wished I had a direction in which I could just let myself flow!”
sooooooooooo true. you said it.
exclamation points. the introverts way of being loud.
What about this union? it sounds good to me
Thank you for this blog
It makes me feel less alone
As an introvert woman, I have missed the boat, the train and the plane and remain in the cinders. This is the only disadvantage ( but a major one) in being introvert. It is easy to find a job with education but extroverts manage to get hold of everything in life.
I wrote a song about extros & intros & posted on a different site recently. I joked that since I was failing at my attempt to explain my extreme introversion (100%), that I should write a song to help him out — since songs seem to be a go-to these days to dumb things down enough for all to get the message — wrap it up in a catchy tune & you get a loyal product following.
Anyway, maybe the like-minded here can enjoy it too:)
“E I, E I, Whoa!”
By someone who doesn’t want anyone to steal her song; just enjoy it
Extro – version, Intro – version
Neither, either is perversion
Outside, Inside, it’s all the same
We all — play the progressive game
Life! In different ways
Paperback, Playground – it’s all a maze
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I, woe ho
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I … Whoa!
It’s about fun, & bein en-ter-tained
It’s interest, but that’s not all the same >> our brain
Intros rock hard on acetylcholine
Extros – on dopamine
Together? We got cyber screens
Intros work long on micro details
Extros burst hard on macro scales
Both needed … to get things done
Needed,… to make things fun
Intro Jobs plus Extro PR
Yielded Apple … n awesome Pixar!
Intro Gates — Microsoft
Exy Jolie — Laura Croft
Kiss? We know they’re Ex-tro
Bella — closet Intro
Facebook, twitter, smartphone, apps … skype
Take or leave tools for any lap type
Hype … gave Intros voices
Extros … get more horses
From wince the coin — came want
Elaborate fabric & font
Power wars, byte-y strip malls
Ooooh, … the needs won’t fall!
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I, woe ho
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I … Whoa!
Talent comes in many flavors
Some red hot, some you’d like to savor
Focus … inside, outside, in between
Mix em together … zest you’d never foreseen
Knowin who you are lightens dark corners
Till then … you’re your own foreigner
Mammal, animal, no control
We need … some Human Patrol
That hate, … comes from within
Get control or you’ll never win
Gotta know your own language, write your own song
Gotta find boundaries, … where you’ve gone wrong
Learn … your own way
To find yourself up in a brighter day
Learn … your own way
To find yourself up in a brighter day
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I, woe ho
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I, oh
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I, woe ho
E I, E I, woe oh
E I, E I … Whoa!
I enjoyed reading your contribution; your comments about the misconception that introverts are shy are so “spot on”. I have just the seen the article on the extraverts/introverts issue and have concluded that I am introverted with a learning style that needs travel and “doing activities” to acquire knowledge. But I can only take so much of the idle chatter before I need to withdraw for some peace and solitude. If anyone wants some positive vibes about the attributes of introverts, I have found a few websites that suggest that introverts make great leaders. I have included the links on my website.
Have you tried not being an introvert?